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 The Determination

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Xasomur
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PostSubject: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 5:35 am

Clan mates, friends, brothers! We are standing at the crossroads. Now it will decide, how ATS is going on. We need you now more than ever. More than a week ago, when the server shut down and the forum was gone. More than back, when we held meetings. More than throughout the elections. We need you now. And we need to stand upright, for that what we really want.

This, my friends, and I am sorry for that, this is gonna be a long long post. But I recommend you all to read it, because it is important. I try to make it most readable as I can. I will make some visual effects and summaries, so that u will be able to pick out the most important parts.

~What happened?~

Last week the server shut down, and the forum were deleted. Outcast was gone. And it seemed he would never come back. We used this opportunity and we made a new start. We put our hearts and our brains together to revive the spirit and the values of ATS. And we did great work. We worked out a new system of leadership, where we all can decide now, where we all share our opinions and our power. We rebuilt a dream.
This is all now endangered to get lost again.
Outcast is back. This morning about 4 am European time he was on the server and invited few of the ATS people to listen to his announcement.
I will now here summarize the conclusion and will take a closer look later on:
  • Outcast is back to overtake the control of ATS again.
  • o.o and fod are going to be treated as enemies again.
  • older members have higher importance and the only voice in ATS.
  • even inactives are more important than newer ones.

And another point I will illuminate later on.
But here comes the hard stuff: Why did he leave then? It was a farce. He never really left. He just wanted to see what happens. “To find out the most loyal members.”


~What does that mean?~
That means several things. That does tell us a lot about outcast. And it tells us a lot about the close future. It tells us that we are on the crossroads.
But I tell you: We are gonna decide which way we go. We don’t have to go where outcast wants us to go.
But step by step.

What would that mean for the clan: It would all go back. It would all happen again. The forum is gonna be set back, the server is. All our work is then gone. All our discussion is then useless. All the visions of a new brighter era are then destroyed.
No council. No public votes for the next admins and moderators. No representatives in the council. Only those “old” ATS in council. And because they are all inactive most of time, it’s only Outcast in Council. He will say who is gonna be banned. And he will ban many friends of ATS and he will even ban further ATS. Like Dudeman or Referee. His attitude will make that people cant stay in ATS, like all those people who left before and came back now. We will get in conflict with o.o again and with fod. We will all again live in fear, without being able to say our true opinion, because we are afraid outcast will do something against us. And you, as a newer member, will always be a member of a lower class in relation to those oldies.

But this isn’t all. This recent occurings tell us a lot about Outcast. And they convinced me finally and totally that this is nothing we need or can bare.


~The Method~
Let me first say some few words about that what Outcast did: He shut the server and the forum down… to see what happens? Who is loyal ATS?
Its like throwing a baby into the djungle and if it survives its good education? My question is, who is loyal then? The parent, leaving the child in the wilderness?
This wasn’t a step a leader should go. It is a sign of megalomania, doesn’t know his own borders, what to do, what is allowed and when to listen to the members needs.
This was a prove that Outcast finally is out of control! He didn’t have to leave. Not shutting all down. Not leaving us the server and so on. Now coming back like nothings happens is mad. So clear and easy is it. It is mad.


~The announcement~
Let me come net to the discussion we held yesterday, which was no discussion.
He first talked hours to Vort who played the middle man. Than me and kernow were added. And Outcast started to explain. But he was not coming to the point… we only discussed over minor things.
Like that he doesn’t like ajunta, and that he had to ignore him and herny…
The most important thing is, beside the content I listed above, his way of treating us. He ignored us. We listened to him and tried to be diplomatic. But he didn’t take any contra. We told him, we made up a new system. He just said, that the ranks stay the same. I said, that the ranks are same, we have new system for ATS in general, and he said, that the ATS values stay the same. And as I finally said, that we have a democracy now, and not longer one leader he just said that I was confused. He was ignoring everything me and kernow were saying. And this is what he does: Ignoring all those arguments against him and getting his head through.


~Generally~
Of course the recent happenings aren’t the only reason why we definitely have to stick to the new system.
As I said: this is just the top of the mountain. Outcast is ignoring the members, especially the newer ones, since long time now. Many people left ATS because of that. Because of Outcast. And it will happen again, as Outcast seems to get more and more crazy.
He also said, that he doesn’t care about the amount of people for or against something. But he misses. If all those, who are ATS, are against him, he definitely has to think about it. He cannot say 2+2 = 5 and saying, that’s right, doesn’t matter what the world says. Maybe it deserves respect, but it does not deserve leadership, as a leader has to see clear. And he doesn’t even see his own members.
Next point: He says, he wants only fun play in jk2. And as u see people leaving ATS because they haven’t fun anymore, and people hiding their opinion because of fear, there is no fun too.


~What to do now?~
Outcast is a threat for the new system and the spirit of ATS, when he is leader again. ATS will be like a zombie again.
We have to stand together, clarify what we are belonging to. To ATS… and not to Outcast. We have to stay here on this forum and on our new server. So take this great news: The new ATS Server will be there very soon. (And we still have the fod server, they are supporting us in not getting ruled again by Outcast)
U may try to talk with outcast, but u will see that he is ignoring your arguments, and that he won tlisten to u, and he will only try to get u on his side. so keep in mind what u want, dont lose ur ground!
We are all sorry that this ends like this, so violently, but if he would just has left we could have honored his image... but as he now tops his old megalomianac attitude. And as we cannot talk to him we gotta do what we can, and when it is just ignoring him.
He is praising that every action has its reaction. And he was always the one to react in his own way to thing ppl around him did. Now it is time to let him see and feel that his actions have consequences too.


Outcast is back. But we wont let him steel ATS.
We are standing at the crossroads. And now its our time to decide.
And to those who still entertain doubts: just read the other topics. how the system is working... and the argues with sylba. This new era is what people want and need. You will finally see.

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Last edited by Xasomur on Sun 27 Jun 2010, 9:52 pm; edited 2 times in total
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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 5:40 am

he is not steeling ATS he just take a vacations and outcast is the owner
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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 5:50 am

Uh, herny, where's your head ? you forgot it in outcast's ass ?
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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 5:55 am

i dont know but he made a lot of thing for ATS with max and is not important playing cause many players are like you dont like "LEADERS" are making a lot of good things niothing more to say

Outcast and Maximus = Leaders
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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 5:59 am

Whatever, they played as cowards so far, if whole clan doesn't want them back, it means all. What they've done is making peoples become as boss, with rage and revanch behavior, and else. Just think, open your mind, don't stare at your admin.
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solid snake
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:21 am

sorry herny xaso is right. but i think we can take outcast back as a recruit like everyone else that would be fair cos he left?
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:22 am

thats fair snake Smile

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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:29 am

you dont understand guys the didnt left
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:32 am

did u read then my post... his "fake leavin" is a prove of getting megalomaniac... he overstepped a border
so we understand... u ol conservatives just wont read and notice... and we are sick of that

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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:36 am

ha no, he just has left us in shit. the leader quitting his members for a "test". it just showed that whole clan is for new leadership.
Xaso's example was perfect :
The poor landmans and farmers wanted equality, and they won : look at whole world now.
It's the same here. ATS needs to get some breath, so they want equality, liberty, they want to be out of supremacy. Whatever outcast does, it's the whole clan to chose, not the leader.
ATS = members not outcast.
If members leave, outcast is alone with you and max, so there is no more ats.
If Outcast leave, what happened a week ago, the whole clan made a new system, every member got involved, and clan is ready for new start.

So a leader can't chose by himself. Only members can chose what they want as lead. They were afraid some weeks ago, now their minds are free and they spoke : council, public vote, and else.
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:50 am

you cannmot decide that
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:52 am

why not? because he is only oneperson? outcast is too... HE CANNOT DECIDE TOO... AND THE MEMBERS DID DECIDE!

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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 6:54 am

okey take care i will stay in the real ATS and not in a fantasy
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Phoenix
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:01 am

OMG back to square one! In the shit again? wtf is going on man! Comon is he staying, is he going, is he staying, is he going? Make up your mind!

I feel like a helpless puppet being minipulated in some major scheme! Sad

Xaso is right we are at crossroads, i think some of us might have to seriously consider the prospect being under a new clan tag at some point!

OMG thats not what i want but........i feel so messed about! And i cant be the only one!

@ herny. I think u a great guy herny but its a shame that u side with max and sylba because in my opinion they arnt active enough, dont care about the well being of ATS so long as they get what they want and just crave power. maybe not sylba so much but maximus i think maybe.

Im sorry to say this coz u are a good guy m8.
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Battledroidlover
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:26 am

I stand with you xaso,outcast banned many of our friends,he gave us a bad reputation,he TESTED on us,he put us through a nightmare,He cant come back,and if he banns me for this,so be it -_-
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Danek
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:31 am

Outcast banned most former ATS for leaving and joining clan he hates(Lord Draco,BlackHand etc)

sorry uncle herny but i stay with Xaso
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BlueNinja
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:34 am

Lol, all that we have done is a fantasy? Did we not bring this clan back to life without Outcast? I don't care what he has ever done, this "fake leaving" is the worst bullshit I have ever seen in a long time and I will never ever put up with that bullshit again. Its just wrong. And Outcast this means loyalty to the clan, NOT YOU.

You are a horrible leader and you don't have power anymore. And this just proves it 100%. Look what is happening with you gone. We are getting freinds everywhere, people are starting to respect the ATS tag, we are all getting a fresh start with new leaders, not one leader, a dictator over all of the clans choices.

And actually, I'm going to thank you for one thing. This "fake leaving". It set US on the right path, it really showed US what WE could do without YOU. No elected officials, just who YOU think is right, and let me tell you one thing. YOU ARE NOT THE SOLE LEADER, NOT EVERYBODY ALWAYS AGREES WITH YOU. AND WITH YOU HERE, THIS CLAN WAS STARTING TO GO DOWN THE TUBES.

All we have done will go down the tubes with this guy if we let him take back control. It is OUR time to shine, and show what WE can really do! And this is just the begining! Just think how succesful we would be when we actually have all our councils and our administration made! We can be so much more!

IF ANYTHING, THIS DOES NOT PROVE LOYALTY TO YOU. IF WE WERE MOST LOYAL TO YOU, THEN YOU WOULD HAVE THOUGHT TWICE ABOUT PULLING THIS STUNT TO SEE HOW "LOYAL" WE WERE. AND IF WE WERE SO "LOYAL" WHY WOULD YOU EVEN THINK ABOUT IT IN THE FIRST PLACE!? WE ARE LOYAL, BUT NOT TO YOU, WE ARE LOYAL TO THE CLAN NOT YOU.

And I also noticed you like to avoid the things that count to stay in power. Is that all you care about? You want your safe clan to protect you from o.o- and FOD and the rest of Jk2 which all hates you. You ever wondered why? Not everyone is born a "rat" some people become "rats" because of what you do.

You are an uncomprimising idiot who thinks to test his "followers" by faking leaving his clan and leaving us in the dirt to deal with our own problems with nothing except our love for, once again, our CLAN not YOU.

Like Xaso said, it is time for us to choose, and choose the fate of ATS.

Would you rather ATS be hated by all? Or respected by many people through Jk2 and have our server filled with people who are willing to train and make us better, instead of a bunch of noobs who only lame with mind trick and spam all over the place.

It's our time to shine, and you can make the right choice for ATS and to make this clan better.
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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:47 am

Meh herny you are stupid, blind, and sheep.
I don't decide nothing, there were exactly 100 votes for the new council, so just stfu.


Also, whatever outcast wants, he can't do nothing, look :
- the new forum is already on, and everyone has this url, so now this is ats official forum
- 99.99 % members are for the new system, while herny, max, sylba are for the outcast's return ( you is ez cuz you just want your admin ).
- A new server for ats will be up soon, and it will be the server where players will come to play because they won't be banned here. So it will be the ats official server too.

So the clan has : forum, server, members.

mmmm, epic fail ?
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Cibbicom
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:52 am

lol outcast why you chose him back he deserted us lef tus behind and now come back with all honour to take it back bullshit mann! I'm for xaso new ats!
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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:53 am

OHHH MAN NOT AGAIN I DONT WANNA FIGHT WITH YOU AGAIN

JESUS CHRIST WHY ALL OF YOU COME BACK "CAUSE OUTCAST LEFT" ohh god THAT'S LOW
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Phoenix
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:54 am

I think im am right in thinking that from these comments that if outcast does come to power again, there will be only 3 other people in ATS! Think about that people on outcasts side!
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Cibbicom
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:54 am

No its the truth
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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:56 am

cibbcim you dont know nothign between us so plz dont put nothing is this topic Wink
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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 7:57 am

Lol, we left because of outcast, only him " and you also for myself ", now outcast was gone, so i could come back to ats cuz it was free of my foe. If you are not happy that i am back, then np. Anyway, don't be angry at free peoples, and free minded. We arn't conservators.
we arn't sheeps that can be commanded by the wish. So now, don't try to use nab sentences. You are low, having no defence, just trying to hurt, and fail once more. All of what you say can be countered.
The difference with before is that now, you only can argue and defend, you can't ban and ignore, that's why this time you fail. First time i got banned, and outcast ran away.
He doesn't like me because he knows that i won't let him do his fricking horrible job, what is making a clan shit and banning all.
So now, anything to add ? me i have all my time to read then write.
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BlackKnight
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 8:23 am

herny..u must know outcast banned most of hius loyal memebers ..arguing they lamed,scripted even hacked..I WAS ACUSSED OF ULOYALTY AND I NEVER LFETS ATS ALONE and here i am as a prove of it..we all are here as a prove of it..Outcast wants to do his will..but if his will is to ban u then u wont have nothing to tell as Xaso said he doesnt listen to anyone...before iw as banned i tried tot alk to outcast and he didnt listen to me he kept saying i was o.oKell soemthign that is stupid, he belives hes god like casue he can rememebr "some"numbers and he thinks he can never have a mistake..he never checked the numbers never show them to me never show me even a screenshot that supported his argue..and i was bnned, mereel,blueninja,lusantlueg, and many others supported me and he just ignore them and clsoed the topic and also deleted my posts when iw as defending..I TELL U THIS SO U WONT FEEL THAT EXPERIENCE OF BEIN BETRAYED :S i was alaso loyal to outcast never tlked shit about hom never feelt superior no nothing always helped clan, my m8's the system, training ppl, organaizing things to mantain ppl habing funny i've always being honest with him and he stabbed me on the back, also ddi with lusant and many loyal memebers to him..sot herny belive me we dont need outcast as a leader..HE CAN BE PART OF OUR SYSTEM WHERE EVERYONES OPINION IS IMPORTANT..and where u can have a second chance to be part of it...not just banning all we "think" are bad or "unloyal"..asi que herny porfavor piensalo bien..yo regrese a este clan porque jamas me fui el me intento alejar..tu debiste haber visto ..alguna ves entrando al server escondido en toros nombres proque el solo buscaba descargar su rencor en los que el consideraba traidores pero jamas les probo nada...eres mi amigo herny y sabes que te apoyo porfavor piensalo bien..creeme outcast no cambiara eso tomara tiempo..pero para eso el debe probar su humildad, sabiduria y buen corazon apra ser lider...pero yo creo que si quiere regresr regresara pero como miembro ..no como lider..o como apoyo peor no como lider..
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