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 The Determination

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Xasomur
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PostSubject: The Determination   Tue 22 Dec 2009, 5:35 am

First topic message reminder :

Clan mates, friends, brothers! We are standing at the crossroads. Now it will decide, how ATS is going on. We need you now more than ever. More than a week ago, when the server shut down and the forum was gone. More than back, when we held meetings. More than throughout the elections. We need you now. And we need to stand upright, for that what we really want.

This, my friends, and I am sorry for that, this is gonna be a long long post. But I recommend you all to read it, because it is important. I try to make it most readable as I can. I will make some visual effects and summaries, so that u will be able to pick out the most important parts.

~What happened?~

Last week the server shut down, and the forum were deleted. Outcast was gone. And it seemed he would never come back. We used this opportunity and we made a new start. We put our hearts and our brains together to revive the spirit and the values of ATS. And we did great work. We worked out a new system of leadership, where we all can decide now, where we all share our opinions and our power. We rebuilt a dream.
This is all now endangered to get lost again.
Outcast is back. This morning about 4 am European time he was on the server and invited few of the ATS people to listen to his announcement.
I will now here summarize the conclusion and will take a closer look later on:
  • Outcast is back to overtake the control of ATS again.
  • o.o and fod are going to be treated as enemies again.
  • older members have higher importance and the only voice in ATS.
  • even inactives are more important than newer ones.

And another point I will illuminate later on.
But here comes the hard stuff: Why did he leave then? It was a farce. He never really left. He just wanted to see what happens. “To find out the most loyal members.”


~What does that mean?~
That means several things. That does tell us a lot about outcast. And it tells us a lot about the close future. It tells us that we are on the crossroads.
But I tell you: We are gonna decide which way we go. We don’t have to go where outcast wants us to go.
But step by step.

What would that mean for the clan: It would all go back. It would all happen again. The forum is gonna be set back, the server is. All our work is then gone. All our discussion is then useless. All the visions of a new brighter era are then destroyed.
No council. No public votes for the next admins and moderators. No representatives in the council. Only those “old” ATS in council. And because they are all inactive most of time, it’s only Outcast in Council. He will say who is gonna be banned. And he will ban many friends of ATS and he will even ban further ATS. Like Dudeman or Referee. His attitude will make that people cant stay in ATS, like all those people who left before and came back now. We will get in conflict with o.o again and with fod. We will all again live in fear, without being able to say our true opinion, because we are afraid outcast will do something against us. And you, as a newer member, will always be a member of a lower class in relation to those oldies.

But this isn’t all. This recent occurings tell us a lot about Outcast. And they convinced me finally and totally that this is nothing we need or can bare.


~The Method~
Let me first say some few words about that what Outcast did: He shut the server and the forum down… to see what happens? Who is loyal ATS?
Its like throwing a baby into the djungle and if it survives its good education? My question is, who is loyal then? The parent, leaving the child in the wilderness?
This wasn’t a step a leader should go. It is a sign of megalomania, doesn’t know his own borders, what to do, what is allowed and when to listen to the members needs.
This was a prove that Outcast finally is out of control! He didn’t have to leave. Not shutting all down. Not leaving us the server and so on. Now coming back like nothings happens is mad. So clear and easy is it. It is mad.


~The announcement~
Let me come net to the discussion we held yesterday, which was no discussion.
He first talked hours to Vort who played the middle man. Than me and kernow were added. And Outcast started to explain. But he was not coming to the point… we only discussed over minor things.
Like that he doesn’t like ajunta, and that he had to ignore him and herny…
The most important thing is, beside the content I listed above, his way of treating us. He ignored us. We listened to him and tried to be diplomatic. But he didn’t take any contra. We told him, we made up a new system. He just said, that the ranks stay the same. I said, that the ranks are same, we have new system for ATS in general, and he said, that the ATS values stay the same. And as I finally said, that we have a democracy now, and not longer one leader he just said that I was confused. He was ignoring everything me and kernow were saying. And this is what he does: Ignoring all those arguments against him and getting his head through.


~Generally~
Of course the recent happenings aren’t the only reason why we definitely have to stick to the new system.
As I said: this is just the top of the mountain. Outcast is ignoring the members, especially the newer ones, since long time now. Many people left ATS because of that. Because of Outcast. And it will happen again, as Outcast seems to get more and more crazy.
He also said, that he doesn’t care about the amount of people for or against something. But he misses. If all those, who are ATS, are against him, he definitely has to think about it. He cannot say 2+2 = 5 and saying, that’s right, doesn’t matter what the world says. Maybe it deserves respect, but it does not deserve leadership, as a leader has to see clear. And he doesn’t even see his own members.
Next point: He says, he wants only fun play in jk2. And as u see people leaving ATS because they haven’t fun anymore, and people hiding their opinion because of fear, there is no fun too.


~What to do now?~
Outcast is a threat for the new system and the spirit of ATS, when he is leader again. ATS will be like a zombie again.
We have to stand together, clarify what we are belonging to. To ATS… and not to Outcast. We have to stay here on this forum and on our new server. So take this great news: The new ATS Server will be there very soon. (And we still have the fod server, they are supporting us in not getting ruled again by Outcast)
U may try to talk with outcast, but u will see that he is ignoring your arguments, and that he won tlisten to u, and he will only try to get u on his side. so keep in mind what u want, dont lose ur ground!
We are all sorry that this ends like this, so violently, but if he would just has left we could have honored his image... but as he now tops his old megalomianac attitude. And as we cannot talk to him we gotta do what we can, and when it is just ignoring him.
He is praising that every action has its reaction. And he was always the one to react in his own way to thing ppl around him did. Now it is time to let him see and feel that his actions have consequences too.


Outcast is back. But we wont let him steel ATS.
We are standing at the crossroads. And now its our time to decide.
And to those who still entertain doubts: just read the other topics. how the system is working... and the argues with sylba. This new era is what people want and need. You will finally see.

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Last edited by Xasomur on Sun 27 Jun 2010, 9:52 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Battledroidlover
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 12:27 am

Shuttup sybla......ATS is still alive and we dont need Outcast....we are dedicated to the clan.....not to a asorb mind trick nab like outcast.....
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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 12:30 am

Sylba what is wrong about Xaso's speech - please eleborate on this.

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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 1:15 am

all of you are wrong and you even know the meaning of ATS -__-" sylba okey sry Wink
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BlueNinja
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 1:53 am

Lol Allianza Total Star Wars. Everybody knows that dude. You have no arguements, you cannot say anything like Ajunta said.
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:10 am

caugh caugh Is ajunta your mom ? your following her to evrywhere Wink
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BlueNinja
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:11 am

LOL now you're going to start insulting like the little immature kid you are? Go crawl to Outcast. I'm not going to fall prey to your stupid insults.
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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:14 am

okey blue , do you really come back cause of Convenience and im saying again that's low xDDD

so

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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:16 am

SyLba wrote:
Dont listen Henry ^^ They just dont know and dont understand.It comes from the one ear and goes off the other

Xasomur did great job writing those things Bu the peoblem is that he wrote many many bad and wrong things.THe things that you write Are not True....

Man find your own clan and do those things this is ATS it was founded by Max Outcast Gich Huraccan you can not do anything to change.

we dont know? tell us, we listen, which u obviously never do, as i wrote u tons of text of explanation, but u dont seem to understand.
it is a very easy way to tell me then i would not understand... but u dont even explain, u say we were wrong and we dont understand, but u totally fail... u should undrstand... or even explain... but u fail at both... sorry dude
TELL ME WHERE I AM WRONG... how can it go from one ear to another when u tell nothing...

i wont change that ATS is founded by max, outcast, gich and hurancan... we never wanted to change that... but we wanted to keep the spirit of ats... and outcast cant do that anymore. and thats why we had to reform this.

if u want to point out ppl who wont understand and dont know... point at urself... sry but when u tell me, that i weren't there so i couldnt know... i tell u u weren't there, u dont know that outcast goes crazy.

i see the support of the ppl here... and at least i just can laugh about u and ur ridiculous posts... there is no input at all... sorry dude

and herny... idk what wrong with u... u took part at some of these meetings... why didnt u open ur mouth there? we listened to everybody... why u cnhanged ur mind... or why did u hide? is that what we did now bad only because outcast is here? no. it is still good. and the fact that outcast wants to destroy that again is bad...
man clear u mind Wink

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BlueNinja
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:19 am

Lol once again herny, you're the low one seeing all you are ever after is following whoever can give you power and Xaso, all he wants is his precious little admin.
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DoZeR~



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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:20 am

What do you pretend ? take over something that is not your ? man this is not your clan you are just part of it
What you dont understand cause i dont think you are retard and you dont here are many usefull people but you cannot steal
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Phoenix
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:23 am

Comon guys this argument is pointless, U will never agree on this matter.

@Blue, herny is a good guy so dont rise if he disagrees with u, he just feels stongly about the situation.

@herny im amazed u can still show loyalty to outcast. He let u down, he let everybody down but u were a close friend to the origonal founders and admin than many of us are so i can understand your loyalty.

The thing is that u should be more pissed off with outcast that anybody else. U were his friend, and maximus' and sylba's too. So you should be more angry that he messed up ATS than many of us. Because u were his friend and he screwed u over, we want to prevent such things happening again. And think: if outcast lets u down how can u still show him loyalty? i dont understand it....... scratch
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 2:25 am

herny-JK wrote:
What do you pretend ? take over something that is not your ? man this is not your clan you are just part of it
What you dont understand cause i dont think you are retard and you dont here are many usefull people but you cannot steal

yes! u got it... this is not my clan! it is now the clan of ATS... of all ATS... not anymore someones own clan... we give the Clan back to its values!
i wont steal... we all wont... we give it back... back to what it's meant to be.

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Skambak
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 3:07 am

herny, deja de decir boludeces! no entendes nada porque no lees todo lo que hicimos con los otros miembros.. no seas tarado.. encerio te lo digo, si no entendes nada, callate, no sigas a los otros mogolicos que nos dejan... si tanto queres el admin, deja de chupar culos, porque ya ni maximus, ni sylba, ni outcast tienen poder, quedate con nosotros, EL NUEVO ATS, y vas a llegar a ser admin... aca rotamos, cambiamos los puestos, todos merecen su oportunidad, todos merecen ser tratados bien... hasta vos decias que outcast era un forro que baneaba a todos... porque te vas con alguien que es asi, cunado podes quedarte con nosotros que organizamos mejor las cosas.. Ah no.. claro, vos no leiste una mierda de todos los posts. si los leyeras te darias cuenta que no empeoramos ATS, lo perfeccionamos, que hacia outcast?.. nada,

Outcast te dejo pelear por la amarilla?, no... no te acoras lo que te dijo? mira.. dedicate a estudiar, aprova materias, despues metete en el juego.. y te recomiendo que empiezes de 0 porque todas las pelotudeces que dijiste son ipoerdonables.. quien te entiende chavon!
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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 3:35 am

So, instead of telling us we don't understand, we don't know, TELL US.
If xaso told shit, QUOTE what is wrong, and correct it. Telling something isn't an argue, but just an empty sentence.
So, tell us, and we'll listen ( agree is another thing, but we'll listen ).

Also, we don't take the clan, the whole members decided it.
As xaso told, history shows it :
for example, in france, when the 90% poor peoples made the revolution, the country was called FRANCE, in 1788, it was called FRANCE. The country was ruled by a king. 10 years later, it had its first constitution, and it was still called FRANCE.
So Now, outcast is the rat, so he choosed his way out, but ATS is ATS. It's just now a fair clan. Loosing rats ( I want to use this word cuz he must have enjoyed much to use it for me ) even if he was founder doesn't make the clan out.
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sebbat
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 3:47 am

Skam me llego al alma lo que pusiste xD
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Battledroidlover
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 4:08 am

Shuttup herny....all u want is that outcast gives you admin for your..."loyalty" and anyway....he may have made ATS...but ATS belongs to all of us.....and if outcast comes back....Fod and 0.0 will just lame and hack etc. but we dont want that.....the reason we have such a bad reputation is because of outcast.......he let us down.....he betrayed us...he stabbed us in the back....he let us work sooo hard for a new ATS...and then comes back to ruin it........
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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 5:34 am

My argument? simple - ATS is in the hearts and souls of its members. a CLAN! I feel that the clan is in everyone not one person.

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Battledroidlover
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 5:36 am

Agreed....now can someone close this topic??? its just throwing insults at each other...so??
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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 5:38 am

We need EVERYONES opinion BDL - Many still need to comment.

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Xemnas
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 5:44 am

Omg well then i must say to outcast sorry that i called em an egoistic worm !! was just an feeling break out cause i found friends in ATS and feared that i will never see them aggain ^^ and could he start the server aggain? and the old forum?
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solid snake
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 5:47 am

I agree 2 ker
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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 5:56 am

See Xemnas i would say the truth came out in his absence and now in his return you show fear of him yes? Don't worry cos i do too - but at the end of the day its about what everyone wants.

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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 6:28 am

New server is up now. ..............~A
if you want outcast to be back so much herny, tell him that the new system is set, and that his place in ATS is no more leader.
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BlackKnight
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 6:48 am

I remember a post when someone wrote that it was unfair to keep the clan and dont return it to Outcast and put up an example of a video game enterprise...very logical if the founder,president or whatever goes and the workers take the control of the enterprise...but what happens if the founder,president.. just dont go..he leaves the enterprise alone and abandon..it will be stupid for the ppl that stay in the enterprise to let it die..Cause they need they will lose a lot of things.. (yeah let see the otehr face of the coin..the workers not the leader..)if the president levase the company..a lot of ppl will lose their work that gives them the money to survive...if the leader doesnt take that in consideration that means that person is not a good leader...cause it is a selfish leader, cuase he doesnt care about what happend with the workers,their problems, their point of view..a leader like that is not called a leader..its just a dictator... a leader is a person who has the skills to guide others to a achieve common objective. thats why ATS is the enterprise...and we were the workers but we were alwasy supressed...by the dictator...one day he jsut leaves and he rly didnt care bout us...And u knwo what i am talking about MAX..
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Xemnas
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PostSubject: Re: The Determination   Wed 23 Dec 2009, 7:21 am

No i dont fear him i just sayd sorry cause he did this if it just was a test then it is ok fore me so i take back what i sayd!
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