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 thereferee's so called scripts

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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:35 am

alright sol ppl first off im not trying to get unbanned or what ever just want some knowledge
alright so scripts
for the past week i have been useing my scroll wheel to kick ppl
that means i bind kick to mwup and mwdown
not 2x kick
my scroll wheel acts as a space bar
so then would that be called a ks
beacuse all i did is move my space bar to scroll wheel
a ks by your rules is any kick that is above 20/21 mine does 22 because i can scroll faster then anyone can press space bar
but what u guys think of when u think ks is one button that lets u kick im not doing that i have to scroll 2x just like all u guys with the space bar


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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:37 am

me i use mouse2, and it's even with mwheel Razz. but people like crying at things they don't like, that's all ^^
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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:40 am

well i could have told you that i wanted nick or xaso or blade to say some really long post saying that they are more pro then me because they push the space bar ^^
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NickdeClaw
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:43 am

I use Right Ctrl, and I own you. Smile
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Hektor



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:50 am

bah, space owns everyone
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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:50 am

this is true u also have like 2 or 3 years on me and im not that into this game as much as like fps
and i want a re
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NickdeClaw
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 2:59 am

I'm just messing with you, countering yours and Aju's whining about people whining. Mousewheel is a bit underhanded - cheating the system if you will - but it's not a script and not as good as a script. I haven't tried it myself, but I'm surprised you don't have issues with it; I had heard that it wasn't very reliable or something, notably from Aju.

The only reason it's kind of lame to be putting kick or attack on mousewheel is that it wasn't how the game was intended to be played in any respect. If you bind attack to mousewheel and use it in saber locks you have an immediate large advantage over your opponent, completely unrelated to skill. The same goes for binding kick to it.

It would kind of be like someone with keyboard + mouse playing Halo against people using a controller; it's just not fair: keyboard + mouse provides an immediate bonus. You would never see mouse vs. controller in a professional tournament because whoever wins is supposed to win based on skill, not machine or control setup. Taking advantage of input methods unforeseen by the developers of JK2 is analogous.

So then it just comes down to this: is using everything available to you to increase your advantage legit and everyone should be doing it, and those who don't do it are just foolishly limiting themselves? Or is it not legit and people who use those things cannot be accurately measured against people who do not use those things?

The answer to that question is just a matter of opinion.
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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 3:12 am

I agree Mr Nick.

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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 3:22 am

so your saying you want ppl to play like the old days
but its ok to do things like mouse wheel kick but it give u an advantage
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 3:30 am

i cosnider mwheel as a script. you cant mwheel when you just put +moveup on the wheel. you have to set a string of commads to make the mwheel work...

so its a lie, you cant jump with it. you cant jump high by rolling it. and me i cant even kick when i am just putting +moveup on it. i think ppl liying when they say they can. i cant. and even if they could, its not the same as spacebar, because spacebar makes you able to jump, roll the wheel doesnt.
and then, as soon as you have put up the string of commands to the mwheel i consider it as a cheat. you need wait commands for the mwheel, which proves that you roll the whel faster than a human body can click any key.

what you can do, which i have no problems with: i can PRESS my mwheel. i cant only roll it down and up, i have the possibility to press it like a key. if you are able to do that with your mouse to, you can bind your jump to it.

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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 3:48 am

ref you make me laff dude. so damn funny.

w
e
h
r
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NickdeClaw
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 4:02 am

Define "old days," Ref. There are plenty of us who don't use any of those things, and we are playing in the present.

After Xaso's post, I tried binding jump to mwheel and it didn't do anything. How exactly do you get it to work, Ref? If Xaso's correct with his speculation, then it is indeed scripting. Not that it would be much different anyway.
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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 4:32 am

alright to get it on mw u have to make a cfg that has the componets of jump not going to post it because then ppl make scripts but just binding +moveup doesnt work u are missing half of it
space bar has just +moveup scroll u have to add one more thing to make it a jump
and yes you cant fly with it but u dont kick if u just scroll ones you have to scroll 2x to get a kick there for its not a kick script becasue u still have to push 2 buttons to get a kick in my eyes

old days i mean when ppl didnt know about scripts and what not/ ppl didnt use them for day to day play .

and wehr its my job xD
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BlueNinja
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 4:46 am

lol. mwheel is a script.
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Xemnas
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 4:54 am

Kernow Pilgrim wrote:
I agree Mr Nick.

I also Agree Mr Nick
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Ajunta Pall
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 5:19 am

just one thing.
NickdeClaw wrote:
whoever wins is supposed to win based on skill, not machine or control setup.
What about fps and ping ?
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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 5:30 am

good point
and blue why do u think its a script?
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 5:34 am

referee, if mwheel scrolling was the same like pressing a random key, then why dont u use a random key.
if it was like clicking mouse, then why you dont click mouse?

instead of that you make up a script and bind it to a wheel, a wheel that you roll. roll faster than a human (at least you ref) can click a key.

its quite legitme to put +moveup on a mouse key, though you can click it faster. but you dont need to set up a script to perform it. there is the line.

and furthermore is it funny, that the command you bind to the wheel is part of some real kick scripts. in fact, you just need to double the command of the mwheel, give it the right wait times and voila... ks. not professional, but it works...

the reason why some mwheelers dont consider themselve as scripters when they use their mwheel, is because indeed one step of the wheel is only making one kick. but the process as a whole is 100% cheat.

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NickdeClaw
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 5:48 am

Ajunta Pall wrote:
just one thing.
NickdeClaw wrote:
whoever wins is supposed to win based on skill, not machine or control setup.
What about fps and ping ?
Indeed, those are unfair things, which is why - in my opinion - you never really know who's best until they have same ping and same FPS, just like you never know who's best until neither person is cheating.

But that's my view. If you take the cheater viewpoint, then low ping, good computer, scripts, cheats are all part of your overall "skill."
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TheReferee///



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 6:08 am

really u roll a wheel i didnt know good thing some one told me that

and the reason i put it on the wheel is because i can do it faster space is slower

and scrolling ones doesnt kick lol
it just makes u bounce ^^

im not quite sure y space lets u go high im not sure what the script is for space but the shortened version is what i do

and u dont have to make a cfg to do scroll i just remembered you can do it in console so is it still a script if u can do it in console ?


and xaso take a chill pill bro its just a question its not like a fight ^^ just step back from the comp if u are ragin
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swiftY



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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 6:14 am

I would say its an unfair advantage using mwheel as a kick,
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NickdeClaw
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 6:31 am

Ref, the definition for script in computing is:
a series of instructions that is executed by a computer program.

If a bind or cfg uses multiple commands, it is definitely a script by definition. Even one-line CFGs can be called scripts too though, as scripting commonly utilizes "script files," which can be only one command long, as in Linux scripting. But you could argue that a one-command CFG is not a script too.


Last edited by NickdeClaw on Sun 19 Sep 2010, 6:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 6:34 am

TheReferee/// wrote:
really u roll a wheel i didnt know good thing some one told me that

and the reason i put it on the wheel is because i can do it faster space is slower

and scrolling ones doesnt kick lol
it just makes u bounce ^^

im not quite sure y space lets u go high im not sure what the script is for space but the shortened version is what i do

and u dont have to make a cfg to do scroll i just remembered you can do it in console so is it still a script if u can do it in console ?


and xaso take a chill pill bro its just a question its not like a fight ^^ just step back from the comp if u are ragin

i dont rage. i explain. if it rages you, you have a problem with it. not me.

the reason you do it on the wheel because its faster than space is flawed: mouse is faster too, and you can use the same code like on space. on mwheel you need a script.

the only command you bind on mouse or space is +moveup
and it doesnt make a difference if you put a script ingame or per cfg, script stays script. i can even put up a real ks ingame. but you need to put up a string of commands for mwheel which includes +moveup waiting and -moveup to make it able to kick someone. thats the basic of every mwheel kick and every ks, only that a ks includes further commands for the second kick.

the thing because you can jump high with space and not with a ks or a mwheel is basically that +moveup aka jump is like running forward: its meant to last until you stop pressing the key.
as soon as you have a ks or mwheel it always contains a command that stops the +moveup in order to make the the resulting kick as fast as possible.
you need two jumps to kick. the first one has to be very short (because if you press space too long you cant kick as well, the shorter, the better the kick, the faster it is and more damage it makes usually) because you need to make the second jump. therefore the first jump will be cut off.
and as every jump of an mwheel is cut off, because you need a command that performs a kick just by performing the same script over and over again (aka rolling the wheel) it wont let you jump high.

on a ks you are more free. you can make any commands, and you are not bound to keep the commands you include, down to a basic command that needs to be able to work in a cycle.

so you can design a ks, that lets you jump also, or a ks that makes you taunt while kicking, or a ks that changes your settings while kicking, or a ks that gets you a coffee after the kicking... just as you wish

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BlueNinja
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 6:45 am

Ref likes to provoke. Don't mind him Xaso.
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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: thereferee's so called scripts    Sun 19 Sep 2010, 7:04 am

Well by Ref's standards he is being polite....

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