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 About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)

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Light
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PostSubject: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Thu 05 May 2011, 2:26 pm

I read (not all) the other post about Osama and many of you were fighting and critizacing the others just for giving ideas of what could be right. I just want to tell you my opinion, and you can have another point of view and thats ok, but don´t try to make me believe another thing of what i think plz:
Well, first some people said that this case of Osama Bin Laden could be totally false (that could be possible in my point of view), but that´s no the point. The POINT is how the USA have treated this case (fake or not, i mean the case). Osama is a terrorist and and OBIOUSLY he made terrible, terrible and terrible things that cannot be forgotten or justificate. Noone can justificate killing thousands of people, but that´s no reason for killing him. OBAMA HAS THE NOBEL PRICE OF THE PEACE FOR GOD SAKE!!! and he tells everybody that, having killing Osama, it made "justice" to the world. You have to got to be kidding me...he has the nobel price of peace and killing a person is how he has a reason or solution for a problem, bah!!
Secondly, the people is celebrating a DEATH. Noone should celebrate ANY death, it doesn´t care what he did. Very very sad...
Thirdly (I continue), They killed Osama and didn´t give him a chance for a trial (it doesn´t matter to me that they have "death penalty", which i don´t believe in it) that is totally against of their Constitution of what the country of USA is based on. Not all countries has their own Constitution, and it´s a pity that they don´t follow they own rules of giving him a chance for a trial and kill him directly without explanation. Everybody has a another oportunity of chance in life, maybe is too late for him but ACTING LIKE HIM?? killing Osama is doing the same thing that he made by bombing the "Twin Towers".
And finally, some people said that the best countries are bla bla bla. For me there is not best countries and all the countries made many mistakes (including Argentina) that damage/involve many people. Noone is perfect or superior than anyone and that´s the reality.

So try to respect other ones opinion and don´t insult him for what he think or believe plz. If someone is going to ask me what i would if someone kill someone from my family, i would answer that despite being angry in that moment i can´t kill him or do something to him/her because i know that i am not a murder like him/her. But I would be glad if that person want to apologise one day, through the years...

PD: Think whatever you want about my point of view, for something we all have different thoughts Smile

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Micr0
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Thu 05 May 2011, 3:06 pm

Light, i agree what you are saying. Nobody should just get killed if they did a big thing. I mean, it's a big thing now because Osama is dead. This world is becoming cruel, they don't care if he dies. They just want revange. And because of this "Revange" Osama's followers [ Who were so loyal They didn't tell anybody where he was ] Might get revange back because USA, killed there leader. I mean if you Loved somebody so much, and they got killed by somebody, would you like to get revange? Revange is pretty much the key word because, that is what USA wanted, now Osama's followers might want revange back..
If you fight fire with fire, It will become hell in this world... If Osama went to trial, He will go to jail for what he did. Which will be better i would say, way better than just Killing him. And people today, are Crazy because of celabrating Osama's death. THAT'S JUST WRONG!
Even though Osama and his followers might of celabrated about the twin towers. But doing this will make us no better than him...
If you guys disagree with me im fine with that.

And Lucifer, i know when i said it will become hell in this world, don't get excited


Last edited by MicroSoft* on Thu 05 May 2011, 5:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Lucifer
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Thu 05 May 2011, 4:10 pm

awwww screw u micro lol!!

but yeah anyways, he is right, this world is basically coming to greed corruption and power, it has since the beginning and will keep going until everyone is dead...They will keep finding a successor no matter how many we kill.. Sure people suffered under this ruthless idiot.. But he is a human like anything else, he has beliefs, just like we have our own.. It was in the end, that judgement was his own undoing..

Death is only the beginning for people like him.. Hell will probably take him with open arms..
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Leonardo
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Thu 05 May 2011, 4:50 pm

Given your location Sindy, you should know. Very Happy
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Thu 05 May 2011, 10:57 pm

light, thank you for backing me up. u just encouraged what i say. fortunately mereel doesnt hate you, which is why he hopefully dont dekarmarize you.
exactly what i mean light Very Happy

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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Thu 05 May 2011, 11:22 pm

It's being reported this morning that Bin Laden had weapons and was going for them when the seals shot him.


Doh!

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TheGraanulaarian
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 12:19 am

It's also being reported that the seals shot and killed at least 2 unarmed people in the compound, including Osama's son.
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Micr0
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 2:21 am

See? they don't care.....Just Revange

~Micr0z~
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Xemnas
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 2:33 am

We should make a section about politic themes
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 2:35 am

agreed with your micro, this is what i heard, i heard he had 10,000 dollars or pound not sure, hidden (stitched) inside his 'gown', he also had contacts numbers stitched into his pocket. how cool lmfao, also 2 members of the SEALS, one of there family members died in the 9/11. if i was there and i had a gun, i would of shot him as soon i as i saw his beard. also i hate people who post on facebook R.I.P wtf? rest in peace, i hope he rests in fire fu.cking troll
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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 4:41 am

You kids are writing lots of BS without backing it up. If you put in facts provide a link to an article from a reputable newspaper online please. Wakie, he had 500 euros on him, not dollars. And the stuff about the Seals having family members that died in 9/11, give us a link to it. You guys are perpetuating BS from blogs or something.... If you don't provide any evidence of the stuff you are espousing you're just as bad as Xaso. All he has been doing is speculating that we killed an unarmed Osama without cause before the facts were clear. These are the assumptions Light was making above too. Get a clue.

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Article about the Euros Osama had on him:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8492845/Osama-bin-Laden-had-500-Euros-and-phone-numbers-sewn-into-clothing.html
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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 5:20 am

lol, in the end idc if he was unarmed or not, because i always said, what shocked me most, is that most ppl dont ask for it,k and just care for theri revenge and the death of that guy. it would have been better, and not only better but RIGHT, to capture him if possible. but you guys only want to see him dead. thats low.
thats morally wrong and its against human rights to deny his rights. and it makes you as bad as him.

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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 9:11 am

I don't need to see him dead. I'm just glad he is.

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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 9:41 am

ok, you are glad of Osama´s death...fine.
Now, the people who died in the bombing of the twin towers are still dead and didn´t back to life or change anything. They are still dead and that´s the fact, by killing Osama you won´t have any satisfaction of "justice" or "happiness" and you know that...
There will be always a hole in your heart because you will never fill it with revenge and that´s my opinion about that bounce

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NickdeClaw
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 9:44 am

Xasomur wrote:
and it makes you as bad as him.
This is a weak argument. It means we did something similar to him, but it doesn't make us as bad as him. Drawing equivalencies like that is just being intellectually lazy and trying to persuade people purely through guilt rather than logic.

As for revenge, different people operate differently with it. Some people are in fact quite satisfied by it, and others are left feeling empty. It's not the same for everyone, and it sometimes varies from case to case.
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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 9:47 am

Light, did you miss us cheering in the streets?????????? It was like winning the World Cup.


;p

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Kernow Pilgrim
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 10:33 am

I agree with you Light on all fronts apart from your last paragraph:

Light wrote:
If someone is going to ask me what i would if someone kill someone from my family, i would answer that despite being angry in that moment i can´t kill him or do something to him/her because i know that i am not a murder like him/her. But I would be glad if that person want to apologise one day, through the years...


You can't judge a situation as extreme as that until you have experianced it. Watch 'Law Abiding Citizen' with Jamie Fox and Gerald Butler. Tell me if what Gerald Butler's character does to the man who killed his wife and son is justified or not. I'll forwarn you that you would rather run into Jigsaw any day than Gerald Butler in a bad mood.

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Xasomur
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 11:01 am

well, did u read the other posts that are already made? im tired of repeating myself. they come with nazi asshat, and before i insult back, or waste time repeating someting they wont read or realize, i rather use short arguments, that at least get ppl to think. it looks as they cant be reached by logic, they are too blinded by the pride of their own victory and the revenge against a vicious person. i cant call it logic, to call someone a nazi, because he stresses international law and human rigths.

yea nick, you can draw a line between the holocaust, 9/11, and a simple murder. 6 million deaths. 3000. or 1. you can say 1 murder isnt as bad as 3000, and 3000 isnt as bad as 6000000.

but for me it is not the number of deaths which makes the crime.
The american civil war took the life of 200.000 from the confederation. but i'm ready to accept, that this was the price for the end of slavery. (a price thats even higher because of all the deaths on the other side as well) But i wont call those 200.000 deaths of the "bad guys" if you so want, as a crime.
The problem is the necessity of death. If it is necessary to kill 200.000 people to end slavery, then maybe its the price to pay. But as soon as a kill is unnecessary, its crossing a border, that shouldnt be tolerated.
Because in my opinion it doesnt matter if you unnecessarily kill 1 person or 100 or 1000 doesnt make big of a difference to me. I admit that there is a difference. and before you focus on this issue of numbers i will clear it up: To kill alot of ppl unnecessarily requires another level of moral sickness, than killing 1 person unnecessarily, when it happens after many reasons to do so are given.
And here come the two points that disturb me so much.

The reason why osama bin laden was searched and persecuted, is because he killed so many ppl unnecessarily. because it was his profession to kill ppl in order of terrorism. So youre just not only trying to erase 1 person, youre trying to defeat the terrorism, trying to defeat the profession of killing ppl unnecessarily.
Thats why it disturbes me so much, that the usa claims this a victory against terrorism, they they just made a big step into the direction of using the same tools like the terrorists. I mean, to defeat terrorism, you have to keep the superiority in the way you are making war. You can only win the war against terrorism if you hold up the ideal youre fighting for. and thats human rights. rights in general. so civilization. i mean: you aint only fighting terrorists. youre fighting terrorism. and any step into fighting terrorism with terror, is not a victory.
Maybe, to make it understandable for a sol member in general, you could compare it to the game. you cant fight cheating in this game, if you fight against cheaters with scripts and haxes. even if you say, "this was the greatest cheater in history and with my ks i pwned him to doom." it still is the wrong thing to do. even if you say a ks isnt as bad as hp hax, wall hax or aimbot.

the other point is the reaction of the ppl. and this i stressed most. because the circumstances of the death of osama bin laden are quite unclear, and of course hidden by propaganda. on both sides. if his death was really inevitable, then its just tough titties. but then its not the fault of anyone.
But the ppl, especially in north america, dont ask for what happened. they are dilirium of victory, pride and revenge. they dont ask for the real circumstances, they dont prefer osama being captured, they dont care for the human rights even. (i wont stress the factor of christianity which forbids to be happy about any death)
They only take the info of his death with joy. they should at least have the bitter aftertaste of something wasnt completely clean. They should have praised the fact that the world is a safer place now and they should enjoy the relief they feel. But then they should question again, what they want to stand for, what are the moral basics, that are reasons for the superiority they feel.
But they dont question anything. It just shows that they pay no attention to the human rights, but for revenge, that they dont care for the civilization which raises them above terrorism, with its values of the stone age.
And thats true, if osamas death was necessary or unnecessary.

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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 11:32 am

ok, i think you are right in that point kern, everyone has different personalities and can act in different ways in that situation I recount. It´s not that easy to know how are you going to react and i undestand that, but maybe if we try to see what we are doing in that moment (before isn´t too late) we can prevent kill the murder with full of anger and try to don´t act like him/her. I don´t have the experience of that situation because i didn´t live it (only i can do is imagine it), but i would try to do the right thing.

Quote :
Tell me if what Gerald Butler's character does to the man who killed his wife and son is justified or not.

As i read, the two thiefs of the story r ape and kill the wife and the child of Gerald Burtler´s character. I am not saying that is justified, it couldn´t be justified IN ANY WAY. You can´t forgive anyone if what happends in the story to Gerald Burtler´s character, happends to you.
Don´t misunderstood me (i see your point) but I think that despite of everything, I have one single hope that, the thief that did that to "my wife and child", could apologise if he changes. I hope on the change, although i have lose "my wife and child" for HIM.

And well for this:

Quote :
I'll forwarn you that you would rather run into Jigsaw any day than Gerald Butler in a bad mood.

What i think is that our justice system is not perfect and we all know that very well (I tell you this because, as i read, Gerald Burtler´s character couldn´t get a fair trial from those thiefs). Sometimes, it doesn´t work as it should be because of bribes, corruption, can´t find the truly guilties from a case, etc. But it´s the system we have and we need to get use to it, for then, to change it for good all together. I say it again for doubts, i don´t believe in "death penalty", in what respect to a solution of a problem...

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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 11:42 am

Xaso, the issue I have with you is you do not respect how sensitive this subject is where Americans are concerned. You push on with your conjecture, like a kid trying to win a high school debate, with no regard for the delicacy of the matter. It would be well received if in certain cases, if you can comprehend the sensitivity of the subject, you would refrain from what seems to be a deliberate intent to inflame, and antagonize. Your diatribe is in the same vain as comments once made by Battledroid regarding Sebb. Both positions were derived from an idealist position but are harmful, and indifferent, to the receiving end.

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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 12:27 pm

calling a german a nazi is very sensitive then i guess.
wehr, with all respect, you showed very little sensitivity here as well. idk if it was you as well, or only mereel using the word nazi, but you said some tastless things as well.

in my opinion it requires a lot of sensitivity and respect when its about human rights and international laws. only because americans didnt hurt german pride specificly with their kind of operation and with their kind of reaction towards the killing, doesnt mean that this was a deep provocance towards anyone who pays attention to the value of laws and human rights and the quality of civilization.

and i dont have to waste my time to win a debate. i get myself into discussions when i think its necessary, and when the topic is something important to me. when i argue its in nearly all cases because i want to solve an issue or discuss about a topic. though i strike back at a point when i get insulted or ignored.

maybe it was a fundamental issue that had to lead to confrontation, that osamas case being a sensitive one is part of the problem. in other words, maybe america wont have forgotten about human rights and international laws, if it would have been a different person, and not osama bin laden.
and of course, the reaction would have been different if the whole tragedy had happen in another country with a lower pride on their own country... so any other country of the world, would have reacted different in this situation. if osama had caused such a tragedy in germany, we still wouldnt have celebrated on the streets after his killing. (plus, germany would never had made such kind of military operation)
this means, that the case osama bin laden is in first line an american issue, is part of the problem

there was no way of facing the problem in a sensitive way.
but i wont feel sorry for not having dropped it, because i had no sensitive way of talkin about it, because i proved myself being in best company, when its about being insensitive.

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wehr



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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 12:53 pm

In economics there is a term "diminishing returns". It is used in production of goods. It's the point you reach when producing another unit of a product the returns start to diminsh. To maximize profits and have productive use of inputs you do not want to produce goods beyond this point. Your discussion is way past the point of diminishing returns my friend. Especially when you went with the Burger King thing. You go to a point where the discussion is no longer productive. It was Mereel that called you a Nazi. I just begin to think you will never like Americans.

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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 2:30 pm

wehr wrote:
Light, did you miss us cheering in the streets?????????? It was like winning the World Cup.


;p

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Amen brotha amen.

This Osama stuff.....just quit it guys. Its not worth fighting over, and idk why we have found time to fight for it. Yes the US has pulled another conspiracy out of its arse, yes Osama was unarmed and did in fact use his wife as a human shield. But this isnt over attacking other races is it? Its over terrorism. So heck yeah Xaso is a decendant from a long line of Nazis. Heck im part German( like 16%) and i probably have Nazi ancestors. Yes Mereel is a big fatty that eats Burger King and McDonalds every week. Hell so do I, unhealthy as it is. This is who we are and we cant change it, not now and not ever. So now it is your choice.....either continue to fight like immature, little girls or we can close this topic and leave it behind us.
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TheGraanulaarian
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 3:02 pm

Well..I obviously missed a lotta shit goin down trying to avoid a conflict of my own. So. Lemme put it to you all this way.

OSAMA IS DEAD.

We can't change that. We can't change why, how, none of it. And NOTHING will be accomplished from racism or insult. Tensions have obviously been high between some members, but we still need to maintain civility, humanity, and above all, RESPECT.

Topic closed, no more of this.
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PostSubject: Re: About Osama Bin Laden (my opinion)   Fri 06 May 2011, 5:10 pm

1 last say on my part before we close this:

1.) Light didn't insult us in his statement of his opinion. That is why I didn't dekarmize him, and I respect (Unlike I do with you, Xaso) him for that. Cheers Light. Smile

2.) I agree to the nail with Wehr on both topics set up by this. Wehr is correct for you being an ass. I totally understand you want to just give your opinion, but you don't help matters with you seemingly insulting us in the process. That's why I responded in the likes.
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