lolol ingrom

Haha, who's ingrom? devY hurt his feelings and he banned like, 3 people for no apparent reason =/.

Edit: Should be nicer.

Igrom, besT admin!

No reason. Lmfao!

Nope, srs, unless you guys have a problem with devY idk about. It was hilarious, like 3 minutes into game, ban, ban, ban. GG.

What were you guys doing during that time?

nice, you are turning into a regular a-hole. hanging with aH and now devvy. sad.

w
e
h
r

Interesting, azzy thinks quite the opposite, but regardless. I'm friends with lots of people on this game, one of the few who don't take it personally. It's why I don't like teaming, I'm usually friends with one of the people fighting =P. ANNYWay, uh, devY was asking him if he was king of the world or something because he was on about how he owned the server or what not so i love you, then ingrom was like yes, banned. I was hopping around the ship in the center thing, and the other guy I think went afk. He was raged at devY lol.

Interesting. Frank begs to disagree with your story.

Frank wrote:

no lame ok?

Wehr, I'm on good terms with more people then bad, but I just play with people that don't take this game so seriously, I fight in a very instigative way, and it's easier for me not to be jk2's most hated if I play with like-minded people. aH don't get up in the morning and go "We hate all, kill pathetic noobs lolololololol." we play the game just like you guys, just in a different fashion, and not so much different then yourself, you just know the right people to be good for, and we just don't care to impose a falsified image. If SoL and Ca weren't the only servers that can reach upwards of 12 people most of the time, we probably wouldn't play there, but unfortunately, old game means less players, and the necessity for logical administration in the surviving servers, as booting everyone forever will just finish jk2.

Nick I didn't kill frank lol, And since when has players saying no lame been terms for instant bans, like I said, Ingrom was there for maybe 3 minutes, and banned 3 people. It was a hurt ego ban, not a lame ban =P. Thought SoL =/= ATS.

raynE, why do you think SoL and Ca are the most popular servers? Do you truly believe that two anti-laming servers are the most popular JK2 servers because laming is good for the JK2 community? Open your eyes man.

At some point you will be forced to realize that JK2 is a unique game and the majority of players want to have fun with each other. The best way for the most number of people to have fun is to enforce anti-laming rules, because that way people who are fighting want to fight, and people who don't want to fight don't have to. It may frustrate hardcore lamers because they have fun killing people who don't want to fight, but they are the minority; that is why Ca and SoL are the most popular servers.

For awhile Nick, (idk if you played that long) the insane force (,if) server was the most popular server in JK2, and the only people banned were people that the current ,if members didn't like. There was almost no administration whatsoever, besides the former mentioned. Then whoever paid it decided to stop, and I believe ATS took the throne for awhile (but who wants to play with that tool Outcast and his scrubbuddy Maximus?), then it branched off into today, with SoL being the most popular force server, and ATS a little in it's wake. (<- The go to when no one is in SoL.) I've understood the uniqueness of JK2 for quite a long time, JK2 more then likely wouldn't of survived this long without admin mods, but, in the same respect, when admin mods came about, a lot of actual good players left. There are VERY few good players left in JK2, we both know that people that are among the top in SoL almost never ban, the only time a ban is ever employed in a majority of cases, is by an admin with a hurt ego, and it's that in itself that brings players to SoL. If you were just banhappy idiots like ATS, SoL wouldn't be so popular. But all that's beside the point. Is there any reason other then "It's my server and I do WUT I WANT!!!" that three people got instantly banned for, at worst case an attempted lame?

Edit: Laming undoubtedly improves skill vs non-laming, so in the pursuit of skill, non-laming servers aren't very beneficial to the JK2 community. HOWEVER, if we're talking about Jedi-MSN, then non-laming is absolutely the way to go. You have to remember, the term "lame" wasn't really spread around up until JK2, most people that go back playing when Dark Forces II was around, dislike the term.

raynE wrote:

who wants to play with that tool Outcast

U british?

Phoenix wrote:

raynE wrote:

who wants to play with that tool Outcast

U british?

Nah, but most of my cousins are, and a few friends. I've picked up phrases from them, and can actually fake the accent itself pretty well, it tends to come out in my typing now and then.

raynE wrote:

Is there any reason other then "It's my server and I do WUT I WANT!!!" that three people got instantly banned for, at worst case an attempted lame?

No, there's not. But that's irrelevant because it wasn't an attempted lame. I was Frank, raynE. People have been complaining about devY for a couple weeks now (not including the many previous months he's caused trouble), saying that when no admin is on he lames like hell and he only acts cautious when admins are on. The admins and the Council have been saying that we need to see proof before we ban someone, and so our Members have been getting pissed off at us for not doing anything. I logged on the forums today, saw that devY and his friends were on, and decided to come in undercover and just be a newb. I saw devY constantly laming people, you killed some people too and you WOULD have killed Frank if I hadn't sidestepped your attacks, and ramsay was gripping people to let you guys kill them. I watched for about 5 minutes and expressed Frank's desire for you to not lame, you guys didn't stop, and so you got the ban that people have been asking for for weeks.

If you want to be unbanned because you'll stop laming, I'll gladly unban you myself in a few days because you don't have much history with us. devY has constantly been a problem and the only reason we continue to give him chances is because we believe in giving people repeated chances, NOT because he deserves them. He makes people miserable and he's not the kind of player we want on our server.

The decisions we make are to promote an enjoyable atmosphere in our server. I'm sure our opinion differs from yours as to what that atmosphere looks like in practice, but you don't have a <em>right</em> to play on our server, it's a privilege that is conditional upon your following the rules. We DO have the <em>right</em> to administrate it the way we want to; if you don't like the way we administrate it, create your own laming server and try to make it popular.

Edit:

raynE wrote:

Edit: Laming undoubtedly improves skill vs non-laming, so in the pursuit of skill, non-laming servers aren't very beneficial to the JK2 community. HOWEVER, if we're talking about Jedi-MSN, then non-laming is absolutely the way to go.

Indeed, and we are a Jedi-MSN server because we seek to improve the social element of the JK2 community, not the skill (we have stated this many, many times). I guess that settles the laming debate.

Whether or not I would of killed you depends on you knowing my state-of-mind at the time, but since all of your points are valid, I agree. If someone asks me to stop laming, I almost always do, because if someone doesn't want to fight, I can respect that. I do admit I fail incredibly hard at doing so when it comes to people that speak like they don't know what's going on, and people that... are just, irritating. Do as you see fit, I could change my IP if I wished, but I don't play that game anymore, and it's a waste of mine and your time. I'd rather be unbanned then have to sneak about playing. Also, the only person I remember fighting was cibbi, and that wasn't a lame by any means. And the 3 times I was chatkilled, I saw no bans, those are my points which are also valid if you were there as long as you say you were, and you're going by the clans rules. In any case, what happens happens. It isn't the fact I was banned, it's why that's the point of this post. I just don't want to see SoL turn in to Still Outcasts Losers.

Edit: I've got work, so I won't be able to reply to whatever you say till later, if necessary.

Well you seem like a legit guy raynE so I'll unban you now. We could really use some people in aH or the "skill" scene to advocate for anti-laming though, at least on our server. We would much rather have everyone playing on our server than banning people, but sacrifices have to be made if we want to maintain the type of atmosphere we believe is best. Unfortunately for lamers, that sacrifice is them.

Do you think you could help out at all in trying to convince aH and other skill-focused players not to lame on our server?

raynE wrote:

Phoenix wrote:

raynE wrote:

who wants to play with that tool Outcast

U british?

Nah, but most of my cousins are, and a few friends. I've picked up phrases from them, and can actually fake the accent itself pretty well, it tends to come out in my typing now and then.

You cant fake a british accent, nobody can cos there is no such thing. Americans (and probably other english speaking countries) tend to think that all british people sound the same, like hugh grant, or james bond, or a "cockney" accent which is london. In fact england itself has the highest consentration of different accents across different regions of space possibly in the world (sticking my neck out slightly here)

Kernow's accent will sound nothing like mine even though we live probably less than 500 miles apart, same goes for BDL or Danek, they will talk totally different too.

I have a geordie accent which has lots of slang words are unorthordox terminology, you would probably find it quite difficult to understand me IRL

For example: If i was to say "Im going down the town", my accent makes it sound like "Im gooin doon the toon". If fact if i was to use "gordie terminolgy i would probably say "az ganning doon the toon" (or certainly true gordies from newcastle talk like that, im from durham so its not as thick)

I'll try and find a video so u can hear my accent

Also we have loads of regional terminology (some of which has spread to other parts of britain now though)

for example:
Aye = Yes
Lass = Girl/woman
Lad = Boy/man
Reet = Right
nor/nah = No
dee = do
gan = go
ower = over
war = our
Canny = quite or nice depending on context. For example "your a canny lass" (nice girl) opposed to "thats canny good" (quite good)

Yeah thats so true they all think we are some posh people. The typical stereotype tea drinkers and crumpet eaters. TEA FTW!!!!!! 2 SUGARS!!!!

As for the birmingham accent im sure youd all think its slow and deep. As people say

"Im from buuuuuurrrrrrmingham"

omg Phoenix, u just made me laugh so hard. americans do not think brits all have same accent. that is funniest thing i've read in long time. i knew when i was a little kid there was big difference between liverpool blue collar accent, from beatles stuff i'd seen thanks to parentals, and the way prince charles spoke.

w
e
h
r

Indeed, and swiftY we pick that stereotype because it's hilarious, not because we think it applies to everyone in England. And Phoenix, yeah you're sticking your neck out a bit, your accent quantity has nothing on USA.

Nick - Thank you. I can try but a lot of people don't view things the same way I do. I'm afraid I can't make many (if any) promises. Not to mention we aren't organized in any sort of way or form, and anonymity is our friend. I can maybe convince some to play nicer, but others are way too independent, and just don't care. In either case most of us are willing to hear out what people have to say, the problem arises when things get instigated, because unfortunately, not a lot of people in JK2 can hold conversations like you and I did.

Phoenix - I'm aware of the dialect differences, the problem is, I have absolutely no idea who is from what part of where which speaks the dialect of whatever, so I generalized with "british".

Kern - Thank you, and yes I am atpK. Having an intellectual debate, instead of a flaming match was nice for a change. Nick is a very intellectual, and down to earth person.

Most people will listen if things are carried out this way, we 'lamers' aren't mindless idiots, we just view society, in this case in a virtual world differently. We still adhere to logic (most of us), and can respect the idea of just wanting to play in a 'Jedi-MSN' fashion for lack of a better term. Lame for most of us is just a way to play the game, not start a huge problem. Huge problems usually arise when the lamee instigates the lamer even more, by insulting them, or fighting back. Unfortunately the idea of a simple "Can you stop laming me please?" PM is absolutely UNHEARD of in most instances and instead is replaced with a public "NO LAME IDIOT!". We don't magically know when someone doesn't want to fight, and insults kinda suck. =[ Perhaps if this was promoted, instigated harassment could be lowered immensely, for us, it's mainly about respect, not just in the area of skill though.

In any case, I appreciate how much this clan (well, Nick I guess was the main person talking, but regardless) actually payed attention to this thread, and how it was dealt with in a respectful, equalized fashion. This is why people that say SoL = ATS are idiots, because it's stuff like this that makes you guys better, and to be completely honest with you, in MOST cases regarding lamers and such. I support your decisions 100%, because they seem fair. You won me over with adding time limits to your bans, instead of ban and clear every 3 months. That in itself shows you're determined to make JK2 better as a whole. So thank you.

raynE wrote:

Thank you. I can try but a lot of people don't view things the same way I do. I'm afraid I can't make many (if any) promises. Not to mention we aren't organized in any sort of way or form, and anonymity is our friend. I can maybe convince some to play nicer, but others are way too independent, and just don't care.

I think the only thing that really matters is trying. Because some people can be told and told and told again, but will never listen. If they don't stop after you've tried, at the end of the day, you still tried. That's what makes you different from other players.


Also, thanks for your help in the incident with reborn the other day.

raynE wrote:

Most people will listen if things are carried out this way, we 'lamers' aren't mindless idiots, we just view society, in this case in a virtual world differently. We still adhere to logic (most of us), and can respect the idea of just wanting to play in a 'Jedi-MSN' fashion for lack of a better term. Lame for most of us is just a way to play the game, not start a huge problem. Huge problems usually arise when the lamee instigates the lamer even more, by insulting them, or fighting back. Unfortunately the idea of a simple "Can you stop laming me please?" PM is absolutely UNHEARD of in most instances and instead is replaced with a public "NO LAME IDIOT!". We don't magically know when someone doesn't want to fight, and insults kinda suck. =[ Perhaps if this was promoted, instigated harassment could be lowered immensely, for us, it's mainly about respect, not just in the area of skill though.

I have worked with a few people on dealing with getting lamed. A lot of newer players fear death. I usually alert them to the fact that dying in game really means nothing. But I think it is a fine idea to further promote these methods of dealing with being lamed. Usually when I teach newer players, this is one of the first things I try to teach.

Nice speech rayne, you stunned me lol, wouldn't have expected this from you.

NickdeClaw (Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:36 am) wrote:

Indeed, and swiftY we pick that stereotype because it's hilarious, not because we think it applies to everyone in England. And Phoenix, yeah you're sticking your neck out a bit, your accent quantity has nothing on USA.

Im not saying it has more accents, but im saying it has many in such short distances compared to other countries.

Can you drive 20 miles north and people sound different from you?